He learned from the best . . .http://video.google.com/videop...=true
Modified by dingoaaron at 5:37 PM 4-29-2006
#1
I'm not denying he's the most talented driver out there and probalby ever but these two incidents have caused me to lose my respect for him.
Quote » For those who question Schumacher's driving style, the two most noted incidents are the 1994 Australian Grand Prix crash with Damon Hill and the 1997 European Grand Prix crash with Jacques Villeneuve. In the 1994 Australian Grand Prix Schumacher was leading Hill, but just barely; if Hill had won the race, he would have won that year's World Championship. With Hill applying heavy pressure late in the race, Schumacher made an error and ran wide off the track into a wall and damaged his car. Schumacher drove back onto the track and turned his ailing car into the side of Hill's as it passed, breaking Hill's front suspension rods forcing him out of the race and handing the title to Schumacher in controversial circumstances.
During the 1997 European Grand Prix Schumacher was leading the race, followed by Villeneuve. Similar to the 1994 incident, a win for either driver would guarantee him the World Championship. Villeneuve attempted to overtake Schumacher approaching a right-handed corner; as the French Canadian passed, Schumacher's car turned sharply into the side of his car. It is an accident from which many viewpoints are still argued, but the FIA, Formula 1's ruling body, judged it to be dangerous driving. Schumacher's car was knocked out of the race, and Villeneuve went on to finish third, behind Mika Häkkinen (his first F1 win) and David Coulthard, who were too far behind in the points to challenge Villeneuve for the Championship. Schumacher was stripped of his second place in the final World Championship standings (with Heinz-Harald Frentzen moving from third to second), while retaining his results and points for the season.
Modified by hawc at 8:26 PM 4-29-2006
#2
He learned from the best . . .http://video.google.com/videop...=true
Modified by dingoaaron at 5:37 PM 4-29-2006
#3
Did you happen to notice that these incidents are from 1994 and 1997? Drivers mature, hawc. No driver is immune to the red mist- especially in the top level of motorsport when competition is so fierceHave you seen Schumi in action? Have you seen when the guy reached over and adjusted his left mirror with his right hand- all while braking from 200 mph and turning in to the first chicane at Monza? Oh- and he was on his way to a pole lap.
How about the time the Bennetton was stuck in 5th gear and he made a pit stop and finished in the points... was that in Spain?
I could go on all day. This is a stupid poll. Sorry hawc, I just lost respect for you.
#4
Quote, originally posted by geofftii2002 » How about the time the Bennetton was stuck in 5th gear and he made a pit stop and finished in the points... was that in Spain? Yeah, it was Spain in '94. I was lucky enough to catch this race on "GP Decade" a couple years ago. It took a while for everyone to realize he was having a problem, and it turns out he was stuck for the last 40 (!) laps of the race. Still managed to come in second. Amazing!
#5
Thanks for......sharing
#6
Senna, Schumacher, Nelson Piquet, Prost, etc.. are no saints on the track. And they can't be if they want to succeed at the level that they have.Now you are going to say that drivers like Clark, Stewart, Fangio, Graham Hill, Moss, etc... never resorted to those tactics and they were gentlemen on the track. Which is true because they only had to worry about one thing: winning. They did not have any corporate sponsors or anything like that. All they did was drive to win.
The drivers today drive to: a) win b) keep sponsors happy c) find more sponsors or retain the ones they have d) keep their place in the team.
Well d) may not apply Schumi at the moment but you gotta understand that thtese guys will do ANYTHING to win. Is it sportsman-like? Probably not.
The only driver in my mind who was immune to this was Gilles Villenveue. He always gave space and if he lost the corner, he would concede and just fight to get position at the next one. He had sportsmanship in spades and was probably the cleanest driver in his day.
Drivers do they their good-sides too. Example: 2001 Barcelona. Hakkinenn was dominating the race and on the last lap, 1/4th of lap before the finish line his car broke down and he got DNF'd. Schumi ended up winning with JV and Montoya on the podium. Schumi said he didn't deserve the race and he did not want to win like that and said he'd give his trophy to Mika because it was really his. JV shared a similar sentiment.
http://www.grandprix.com/gpe/rr668.htmlAlso don't forget Senna getting out of his car to help someone who crashed (I don't remember the details at the moment).
I totally agree what Schumi did to Damon and JV was wrong and it did make me lose some respect for his on-track behaviour. I have nothing but utmost respect for his off-track persona, especially his humility and benevolence.
Modified by mAdD INDIAN at 1:50 AM 4-30-2006
Modified by mAdD INDIAN at 1:56 AM 4-30-2006
#7
Oh and since we are on the topic, I thought this was relevant:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...sennaSchumi took out Senna and proceeded to get a verbal lesson by him.
#8
Who remembers Schumacher passing Hill who was on pole during the warm up lap at the British GP in 1994?WTF?
Then during the race, he ignored signals to come in for a penalty and he was ultimately back flagged
#9
Thanks mAdD INDIAN. Very well put.
#10
I've been told that once, while testing at a track the week before a race (can't remember which test track), after a long hard day of testing, and after being swarmed by fans throughout the day, a guy approached him for an autograph, but dropped his glasses. Schumacher went, picked up the glasses, and handed them to the guy. I thought that was a pretty cool story, and a good reflection of his personality...
#11
Quote, originally posted by mx5er » Who remembers Schumacher passing Hill who was on pole during the warm up lap at the British GP in 1994? Then during the race, he ignored signals to come in for a penalty and he was ultimately back flagged
Schumi got DQed for three races in '94 didn't he? Due to the whole Benneton-fuel-rig affair. On top of that, they were accused of having some type of banned traction control or something as well. They definitely suffered a hard time in '94, yet he still managed to get WDC.
#12
Quote, originally posted by MagicGLIturbo » I've been told that once, while testing at a track the week before a race (can't remember which test track), after a long hard day of testing, and after being swarmed by fans throughout the day, a guy approached him for an autograph, but dropped his glasses. Schumacher went, picked up the glasses, and handed them to the guy. I thought that was a pretty cool story, and a good reflection of his personality... When Schumi won his very first F1 race at Spa, he put his trophy in his backpack and cycled to his parent's hotel from the race track.
#13
Quote, originally posted by mAdD INDIAN » Schumi got DQed for three races in '94 didn't he? Due to the whole Benneton-fuel-rig affair. On top of that, they were accused of having some type of banned traction control or something as well. They definitely suffered a hard time in '94, yet he still managed to get WDC.
Yeah, in 1994, launch and traction control was banned. The FIA found the codes for both traction and launch control in the ECU. But Benetton said even though the codes were there, it wasn't used.
The fuel fire at the German GP was attributed to debris being lodged in the refueling nozzle. Benetton thought removing the filter from the fuel rig...which BTW was illegal
#14
This is why I don t like hawc.
#15
Quote, originally posted by mx5er » Yeah, in 1994, launch and traction control was banned. The FIA found the codes for both traction and launch control in the ECU. But Benetton said even though the codes were there, it wasn't used.
The fuel fire at the German GP was attributed to debris being lodged in the refueling nozzle. Benetton thought removing the filter from the fuel rig...which BTW was illegal
Almost every team disabled TC in this manner, they were just singled out....likewise with fuel rig......they removed it, as did other teams....the rig manufacturer even okayed it....you should read Steve Matchett's book about that season.
#16
well, even though it's cliche:Rubbin' is racin'
and
There are two types of racers: Cheaters, and losers.
#17
Quote, originally posted by Burnin8r » This is why I don t like hawc.
i mean, seriously, WTH, hawc......JPM is a better choice?he would be schooled worse than Schumacher was by some of the people he's driven against.......
you think Senna, Prost, or Piquet would think twice about putting JPM down a lap.....or three? Senna would eat your boy alive.........repeatedly........let's see how good JPM is when he has only 1 gear to drive w/ at a course like Monza.....then we'll talk......
#18
WTF? hawc just pulls the pin on a grenade and throws it into a crowded room...then he doesn't even stick by to watch the aftermath?Classic hawc!
"Of course that's just my opinion; I could be wrong."
Originally Posted by Blackballed
#19
what are you talking about, i'm still here. i'm always here. i never leave.i think there's a big difference between "rubbin' is racing" and purposely ramming someone with the sole intent to crash them out of the race (not just trying to merely get by them.) that's why i don't like schumacher.
the crap he pulled on DH and JV was to crash them both, not to squeeze by under difficult circumstances. that's not racing.
that's like kicking a board game on to the floor and going, i won!
Modified by hawc at 11:34 PM 4-29-2006
#20
Quote, originally posted by poorkid » JPM is a better choice? Why yes, yes he is....
#21
I'm going to agree with hawc that Schumacher's on-track sportsmanship history is not the best of the front-runners in recent history. I also fully agree that Senna was of a similar Machiavellian mindset at times.One could probably make an argument that because Schumi hasn't exhibited that type of behavior recently, he has matured out of that phase. To take it further, Senna and other historical peers were taken out of the sport before they had a chance to arrive at Schumi's experience/success level.
Whatever. At the end of the day, Schumi and Senna both have black marks on their records. Their subsequent on- and off- track actions hopefully override those black marks.
#22
Quote, originally posted by hawc » Why yes, yes he is.... Except when he gets accidentally bumped in the head by a camera operator. What a baby.
#23
Schumacher: Freaking Amazing.
- Austin
#24
mmmConnie.Actually Montoya has pulled some amazing moves on Schumi and others, so he definitely has "it". Problem is he seems to lose "it" a lot as well.
#25
JPM = highly overrated... he's a non-factor this season. I suppose if I had a wife like his I'd be distracted too.
I had a sig but then Vortex eated it.
#26
Quote, originally posted by Voodoo.T » JPM = highly overrated... he's a non-factor this season. I suppose if I had a wife like his I'd be distracted too.
He drove a great race in San Marino GP. He made podium and totally outpaced Kimi the entire weekend.He's gonna give Kimi a run for his money this season...or he will be at each race until he makes his trademark dumb mistakes
Don't forget last year's Hockenheim race where he stuffed it in qualifying but during the race went from last to 2nd. It was a superb drive by him.
Modified by mAdD INDIAN at 12:50 AM 5-1-2006
#27
You could use that belt buckle as a dinnner plate.
#28
Quote, originally posted by Voodoo.T » JPM = highly overrated... he's a non-factor this season. I suppose if I had a wife like his I'd be distracted too. He did better than Kimi last race...he's no Schumi, but he's not overated, his car control is amazing.
#29
Yeah he is probably the worst dresser in the worldAnd there are pics MUCH worse than that.
#30
Quote, originally posted by hawc » I'm not denying he's the most talented driver out there and probalby ever but these two incidents have caused me to lose my respect for him.
Modified by hawc at 8:26 PM 4-29-2006Dude...it happened 12 and 9 years ago. Get over it.
The positives in his career outweigh the negatives 100 to 1.
#31
Montoya rules
#32
Quote, originally posted by Beltfed » Awesome. Simply awesome. I love it when Germans play cowboys and indians. I don't really understand all the patches, but I'm sure it's cool over there. I'm starting to understand their love for Hasselhof.
#33
I read a story a while ago by a journalist who hung around in the stands near pitlane after 2005 Canadian GP. The place was pretty much a ghost town. The stands were empty, and most teams were already close to finished packing. The journalist noticed that there were a couple of grunts working in the Ferrari garage, packing the last of the totes. Schumi came out and chatted/laughed with them, giving them a hand - no superstar mentality like most of the other drivers.That is one of the many reasons Schumi is such a strong force - dedication to the team.
#34
Quote, originally posted by hawc » Awesome. Simply awesome. I love it when Germans play cowboys and indians. I don't really understand all the patches, but I'm sure it's cool over there. I'm starting to understand their love for Hasselhof. Did someone say Hasselhoff?
#35
JPM is great.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...ntoya
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